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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
 Posted - 20/12/2007 : 10:22:22
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quote:
Hi there guys.Just a question regarding round 3:does hares ear fur and gold of any kind have to be incuded in the dressing?Magnus asks us to tie set of three GRHE but gives a free choice of materials.For my taste GRHE without above is not a GRHE .Also not sure about how to understand a SET of flies.For first round I tied set of three Wingless Wickhams and did them on identical hooks and wanted the finished flies to be very simillar.Round two Black Brahans were on diferrent hoks(one single,two doubles size #10 of course) and I used both red floss an red holographic tinsel for the body therefore flies tied to the dressing given didnt look the same.For the round 3 I presume every fly included in the set should be of diferrent dressing(materials or tying technics) but still within the description given by Magnus in the top of this topic,am I right?
And finnaly,is it ok to stick just to the original dressing?
Regards-Hubert
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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
Posted - 20/12/2007 : 10:45:51
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The Masters Advice section says something like:
quote:
Masters – size #16 or #18 – get creative - any colour, any dubbing, any rib material, any tail, any thorax cover. Stick with the basic structure and theme – a buggy dubbed Nymph to be fished in a clear healthy stream. Your flies need not be weighted.
The idea is to treat the GRHE as a generic fly type. Changes should take into account this is a GRHE and should stick with the basic structure and theme.
It is a GRHE so I would expect a gold rib - but the rib material can be whatever you decide to use. The GRHE Nymph uses blended hair from the mask, not just the ear - I have no way to check where the hair comes from so it would be pointless stipulating where the dubbing comes from. When I tie these the dubbing tends to come from a box  or a skin and I mix a batch when I'm tying a bunch of flies.
quote:
For the round 3 I presume every fly included in the set should be of diferrent dressing(materials or tying technics)
Why? I'd assume in a set of steak knives they'd all be the same? You're welcome to make this more complex but it actually may not be advantageous. The three flies can be different but should be the same - a set - where it counts.
Next year I'm introducing a stipulation that all three flies must be tied on the same hooks.
The idea of tying three is so I can assess consistency - not so easy when flies come on different hooks. I have not penalized entries on different hooks - but they don't gain any points either - if I have doubts about consistency then tying three very different flies may conceivably cause the entry to lose a few points.
My advice would be keep it simple - look at the basic pattern, think about the brief, choose your materials and any tweaks or amendments carefully. Then tie three IDENTICAL flies. You know how difficult it is to tie three exactly matching flies.
Magnus
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Robert Ryan Houston
New Member
39 Posts |
Posted - 20/12/2007 : 11:38:05
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| well back to the vice it is then. i had silver ribbed olive hares ears tied .i thought the brief was very broad basically a nymph of sorts well tied .its good to know how you interpret it magnus have the fly in my head now have to fight with the 14/0 silk again gonna stick to black i think it makes the head more distinct especially in small sizes |
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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
Posted - 20/12/2007 : 11:53:03
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Hi Robert
quote:
It is a GRHE so I would expect a gold rib - but the rib material can be whatever you decide to use.
Robert
I'm judging a tying competition not running a branch of the Fly Police. What I expect and what I get are two completely different things. You guys have a brief for this round - its up to you how you fulfill that brief. If your flies surprise me - are not what I expect - that's absolutely great - so long as they are well tied.
If you want yours with silver ribs thats fine by me. I'm a lot more interested in things like proportion - body shape - regularity of ribs.
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huba1973
Junior Member
73 Posts |
Posted - 20/12/2007 : 13:27:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Magnus
The Masters Advice section says something like:
Why? I'd assume in a set of steak knives they'd all be the same? You're welcome to make this more complex but it actually may not be advantageous. The three flies can be different but should be the same - a set - where it counts.
Next year I'm introducing a stipulation that all three flies must be tied on the same hooks.
The idea of tying three is so I can assess consistency - not so easy when flies come on different hooks. I have not penalized entries on different hooks - but they don't gain any points either - if I have doubts about consistency then tying three very different flies may conceivably cause the entry to lose a few points.
My advice would be keep it simple - look at the basic pattern, think about the brief, choose your materials and any tweaks or amendments carefully. Then tie three IDENTICAL flies. You know how difficult it is to tie three exactly matching flies.
Magnus
I thought showing ability to tie same pattern on diferrent hook shapes will gain some points,it doesnt work this way,fair enough.
Yes,tying three matching flies,specially on #16 is not easy job,as is not GRHE itself.Well,there must have been some reason behind choosing this fly on #16-18 for the round 3,this is a real challenge and test of abilities
Regards-Hubert
PS.Guys,please excuse me any linguistic errors,English is not my first language |
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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
Posted - 20/12/2007 : 13:47:04
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Was I was being soft saying 16 to 18 
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Martini Fisher
Junior Member
90 Posts |
Posted - 20/12/2007 : 16:59:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Magnus
Was I was being soft saying 16 to 18
Make em suffer Magnus. I think its downright " Namby Pamby" letting them tie on salmon irons.
Next time make them do a Surface Lure tied on a 26 with a 32 trailing hook!!
As for us "Open class" inferior types a size 8 or 10 would have been much fairer.
On a serious point is it not easier to "hide" faults on smaller hooks than a 12 or 10?
I know you will have a view on this folks so bring it on
Cheers
Keith
Any time Any place Anywhere theres water |
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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
Posted - 20/12/2007 : 19:32:44
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It'll be interesting Keith. All the flies are checked with a loupe - far easier to see how a fly was made.
The challenge is producing a well made fly that size - then two more the same.
I'd be interested to hear what you guys think about sizes - I find it far easier to tie larger Nymphs the same time after time - I can see the buggers. Below a #16 I depend on magnifiers to see what I'm doing - often use them tying larger too.
When I come to the Report I'll photograph some of the sets. I'd guess the flies are about the same magnification on the page - depends how much space they give. Seeing your flies at several time life size does nothing for your confidence. |
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Martini Fisher
Junior Member
90 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 04:19:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Magnus
It'll be interesting Keith. All the flies are checked with a loupe - far easier to see how a fly was made.
The challenge is producing a well made fly that size - then two more the same.
I'd be interested to hear what you guys think about sizes - I find it far easier to tie larger Nymphs the same time after time - I can see the buggers. Below a #16 I depend on magnifiers to see what I'm doing - often use them tying larger too.
When I come to the Report I'll photograph some of the sets. I'd guess the flies are about the same magnification on the page - depends how much space they give. Seeing your flies at several time life size does nothing for your confidence.
Agreed Magnus. I thought you would be using a magnifier to keep it fair. And as you say seeing flies three or four times actual is very un-nerving. But it does show you where you went wrong. Knowing where you went wrong is one thing putting it right another!
It would be great to see a report with a few of the good and maybe the bad. No names no pack drill and all that jazz though.
The bigger flys should be easier to tie well. Which lets me out of the equation straight away.
Did my Brahans arrive in time?
Cheers
Keith
Any time Any place Anywhere theres water |
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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 05:19:10
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| Yes - arrived safe and sound. |
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Robert Ryan Houston
New Member
39 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 12:36:14
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| hmm now i dont know what to do have tied some gold ribbed hares ears sorry possums ears one on a fulling mill the other a partridge am deciding which is better do you want us to include the dressing when we send them away |
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Robert Ryan Houston
New Member
39 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 12:41:39
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| as a matter of interest did my method of packaging work for the evening star ,i tried placing foam to keep it still and stop fibres getting out of place' i;m still thinking how to send the nymphs so as not to displace the tails |
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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 19:44:02
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Actually it didn't work too well - the JC pairs were disturbed and the topping was positively beside itself
So long as I can re-seal the container - and I don't mean spend 20 minutes rebuilding the box using tape and pins. |
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Robert Ryan Houston
New Member
39 Posts |
Posted - 22/12/2007 : 07:35:28
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i was afraid of that. i had some other fully dressed flies that i had tied set in a box in similar fashion ,when i opened them the other night the sticky foam must have given up or something and they were all over the place .very annoying when you spend a long time brushing fibres and setting feathers into the right position. but how do you send something so delicate through the post i didnt want to plaster it in hairspray sorry if it gave you any hassle. had thought of cotton wool but thought it would catch fibres as you removed it or would stick to it.
on another note is there a list of conventional proportions for each given fly type somewhere. i tie flies that i like the look of, but some of the posts seem to talk lots about acceptable tail length ,gape /length ratios and hackle fibre length etc. what i am worried about is when it comes to a style of fly we are not used to tying that what i cosider a nice looking fly might not fit acceptable proportions. for example i never tie ordinary hair wings so the brahan was new to me ,i tied longer tails than in the picture but have since found some conventions on crest length to hook gape that i may have exceeded so if there is some sort of template on the web could someone direct us there please |
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paul clydesdale
Junior Member
57 Posts |
Posted - 22/12/2007 : 09:48:58
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hi robert
when sending flies of for the league i use small clear plastic single compartment boxes i purchased from glasgow angling center which have a plastic hindge one side and clasp the other side.they measure 4" lenght, 2.5" width and 1" depth,i use one box for my key flies and one box for my extra fly.i cut a small rectangular piece of coloured card for the bottom of the box(to make it look nice)and stick it down, super glue should do it(used epoxy on the last ones think that was a bad idea).to secure the flies down i stick a thin piece of sticky back foam lenght ways down the card,then your flies can be inserted in through the foam..
the boxes are only 75p from glasgow angling center,and the foam i get for nothing,iam a gas service engineer and we use the sticky back foam for sealing boiler doors.
if you e mail me your address i will gladly send you a couple of boxes(got loads) and a bag of sticky back foam,you can try it for yourself.
paul.. |
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Magnus
Administrator
529 Posts |
Posted - 22/12/2007 : 19:12:58
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Hi Robert
quote:
is some sort of template on the web
To the best of my knowledge there's no such resource. I'm not convinced there needs to be. |
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GRHE
